Life in isolation. The thread

[Firkragg]

Oh its much more diverse than just talking about mink, of course

Out of a cultural curiosity BillButNotBen, how have people been doing with following Corona guidelines where you live? Especially when out shopping? I ask because people are fatigued with restrictions (in my part at least) here in Denmark (as is everyone, everywhere I presume). But then I read how New Zealand have been handling the pandemic and think godsdamn, well done on them, thats how you pull together as a society. We just got our word of the year here and its “samfundssind” = society-minded for a direct translation, but I don’t see it applying as much as it should, not with our growing covid numbers, incorrect handling/poor mask discipline, not keeping distance and so on.

New Zealand deffo should have society-mindedness (there has to be a better phrasing) as its word of the year.

[Sarfrin]

Well, four days from Christmas with lorries already backed up at ports, companies desperately trying to stockpile and still no idea of what will happen post Brexit in 10 days time, we’re cut off from the continent. Fucking brilliant. Best government ever.

[LexW]

Elect a clown, get a circus. Astonishingly I saw an interview with some Johnson voters recently and they were all like “Oh yeah he’s incompetent and has really fucked things up, but at least he’s a real person! That Starmer is acts like he’s prosecuting a murder case at PMQs!”. It’s like, motherfuckers what the actual fuck is fucking wrong with you? You want the murder case guy running the country - he’s taking it seriously. The “real person” (which Boris most assuredly is not) should be writing a newspaper column or whatever, which guess what, used to be Boris’ job!

As a bonus in London we’re now in Tier 4, i.e. “lockdown-lite”. Why couldn’t we just have stayed in lockdown and avoided this shit getting worse? I assumed they’d keep it on until stuff died down and thus we could have a moderate-risk Xmas, but nooooo, they ended it immediately and a few weeks later it’s Tier 4 time.

The Brexit stuff is similarly demented - these arguments are almost entirely over stuff that could have been figured out years ago.

[BillButNotBen]

Out of a cultural curiosity BillButNotBen, how have people been doing with following Corona guidelines where you live? Especially when out shopping? I ask because people are fatigued with restrictions (in my part at least) here in Denmark (as is everyone, everywhere I presume). But then I read how New Zealand have been handling the pandemic and think godsdamn, well done on them, thats how you pull together as a society. We just got our word of the year here and its “samfundssind” = society-minded for a direct translation, but I don’t see it applying as much as it should, not with our growing covid numbers, incorrect handling/poor mask discipline, not keeping distance and so on.

It’s a bit hard to nail down. It’s always been a country of weird dichotomies.

In general, people here are much more conscious of others, even than themselves. This is deeply ingrained and can be positive or negative. But it has meant that everyone has been wearing masks since february, and that people mostly don’t do dumb things that might spread the virus. Everytime we see news reports from other countries my wife is shocked by how thoughtless lots of the people are being. (That said, there’s almost no ‘distancing’ as there’s rarely room for that)

There’s also an unhealthy general fear of everything, which is stoked by the endless tv shows, but in this case has probably been a positive.

So there’s not really a sense that people are fatigued with the restrictions. I mean, a lot of people here are also a bit bored of watching netflix every day, but there’s unlikely to be any pushback.

But Japan is a country with a massive restaurant / entertainment / domestic travel industry, so the government is much more focused on making sure that isn’t too financially damaged. As such, the government has been encouraging everyone to go out and travel and eat as much as possible. Which Japanese people ordinarily love to do.

So you have this somewhat flipped situation where people’s natural caution is telling them to stay home, but the government is telling them to go out.

So, despite no real official lockdowns, everywhere was pretty quiet from March to Sept as most people stayed at home. But since Oct the number of people has been gradually increasing back to almost pre-Covid levels. Finally the government has overcome a lot of people’s fears.
It’s not exactly fatigue, though there is a little of that, it’s more that people have kind of stopped being afraid of it.

Despite lots of people going into town these days, they do all wear masks and avoid risky activities as much as possible. when sober. The only problem is that it’s hard to wear masks and avoid risks when eating and drinking in a tiny Tokyo bar.

[Skalpadda]

I was very surprised that we put an entry ban from the UK in almost immediate effect. Probably much too late and we can’t prevent Swedish citizens from returning home so probably pointless anyway, but still surprising.

Seems our politicians have generally started taking a somewhat harder stance than our public health agency in the last couple of months (although we still have very light restrictions compared to pretty much everywhere). I’d be interested to know if they’re just trying to save face by making a show of action or if they’re genuinely fed up with FHM being catastrophically wrong time and time again.

I’ve taken time off and am self-isolating for two weeks because I really want to be able to visit my mum on Christmas eve. Luckily I don’t suffer too much from being alone, quite happy to sit around in my pyjamas practicing guitar and playing games most of the time. I renewed a pact with a friend (who is doing the same) to call and chat for an hour every day.

I am complately and utterly disillusioned with my countrymen’s ability to act responsibly after this year though. Most have of course, and it’s not like even those who act like morons are purposefully evil or anything, but so many are just thoughtless and won’t think far enough to show solidarity and care for other people. It’s really disheartening.

[Sarfrin]

Given that I would happily push a significant proportion of my countrymen into the sea after the last couple of years, I’m not at all surprised that other countries would leap at the chance to stop them entering.

[LexW]

I am complately and utterly disillusioned with my countrymen’s ability to act responsibly after this year though. Most have of course, and it’s not like even those who act like morons are purposefully evil or anything, but so many are just thoughtless and won’t think far enough to show solidarity and care for other people. It’s really disheartening.

I feel similarly, and it’s hard not to add some xenophobia into the mix (not something I normally experience) given many/most of the people just totally and utterly ignoring the restrictions, at least in the parts of London I’m in, are not British (by that I mean culturally - black British people for example, are if anything more conscious re: masks than white British). It seems to be incredibly reliable that if someone is speaking Spanish, Italian or Romanian, to a friend or more often on a mobile, they not only aren’t wearing a mask, but show no sign of owning one.

But there’s also been just shockingly moronic shit from a like, a significant fraction of the popular regardless of anything else. The day the most recent lockdown ended, suddenly virtually everyone seemed to decide they didn’t need masks - like what the actual fuck? That changed over the next few days, but why? The government sure didn’t say “Yo, no need for masks!”.

And the saddest thing was, when we had a couple of really chilly days, suddenly everyone was wearing masks, and the asswipe fashion of not wearing masks over your nose (how the fuck is that going to work? Do you also just wear your knickers under your balls or something? It’s almost always dudes) vanished, because people clearly realized masks were actually quite pleasant when it was actually cold. But this really proved that not only do all these people have masks, and are able to use them, they’re only not doing so out of the mildest of mild discomfort/annoyance, and the moment that shifts, they wear them. Which somehow makes the whole thing worse.

[DeekyFun]

Given that I would happily push a significant proportion of my countrymen into the sea after the last couple of years, I’m not at all surprised that other countries would leap at the chance to stop them entering.

Now, now. Its not okay to pollute the seas.

[Skalpadda]

There’s definitely an issue with larger spread in immigrant communities here, but I’m mostly pissed about the general sense of casual carelessness and entitlement on display, which I’ve seen most of in the middle class. People who could easily choose to be more careful but just don’t because it’s inconvenient, and treat the (relative to other countries) very light restrictions we’ve had as some massive personal burden rather than the disease that’s killed 8000 people.

[LexW]

Yeah I think in the UK, at least in London, the middle class tend, on the whole, to be “rule followers”, and embarrassed if they get caught/seen not following rules, so they’re less of the issue. Some do chafe at even mild restrictions, but they tend to get a lot of pushback (often from people they expect to agree with them), and aren’t lauded as they expect. There’s also some real stupidity from certain people, like Eric Clapton (who is also an incredible racist, I note, which people often overlook), and Van Morrison (!?!!??), who put out a pathetic whinge-album full of conspiracy theory shit.

Hear Eric Clapton, Van Morrison's Anti-Lockdown Song 'Stand and Deliver'

I don’t think Clapton or Van Morrison realizes that by pointing out they’re particularly concerned about “live music”, they’re undermining their entire conspiracy theory deal and showing it’s simple self-interest on their part.

[Grizzly]

We had an outbreak in the immigrant communities as well, with the usual fascists complaining about it (even though the same fascists also oppose the very regul–*). Wonder how much of it is just language barriers, as well as a lack of enforcement of regulations in companies that often use immigrants for labour. There’s been a whole bunch about meat packing plants that use workers from Eastern Europe just either flat out lying about what the regulations are to their workers or telling the labourers who are sick to lie about that to the inspections the Dutch and Belgian governments did.

Partly strikes me as similar as how lots of students were getting the blame for spreading due to all the partying they’re supposedly doing,but if you look at actual surveys students care more about the rules then most about anyone else, it’s just that student housing is bad for social isolation purposes (sharing a kitchen with 8 people wooo).

[Skalpadda]

Wonder how much of it is just language barriers, as well as a lack of enforcement of regulations in companies that often use immigrants for labour.

There have been things like big weddings that’s obviously a bad idea but at least here I think the main reason is as simple as immigrants are more likely to have jobs where they can’t adjust their own hours, can’t work from home and are more reliant on being out and about, use public transport, etc.

There’s also some real stupidity from certain people, like Eric Clapton (who is also an incredible racist, I note, which people often overlook), and Van Morrison (!?!!??), who put out a pathetic whinge-album full of conspiracy theory shit.

The irony of extremely wealthy old white guys whinging about this shit. Want to do something concretely useful for people who can’t gig? Set up a fund that organises and pays musicians for livestream gigs or something.

And to illustrate my frustrations with entitled dickheads:

Stor oro för smittspridning i fullbokat Sälenfjällen

"Great worry for disease spreading in fully-booked Sälen fells

After the Public Health Agency gave the go-ahead for trips to the fells many places in the Sälen fells are fully booked. There are long queues where many don’t keep their distance and the worry of covid-19 spread is mounting"

Yeah, fuck FHM for saying it’s okay to go to a skiing resort over Christmas (with the usual caveats of “be responsible blah blah blah” - this is again in contrast to the national government that’s been telling everyone to stay at home) but also fuck all the eedjits who ever thought this would be a good idea.

Fullbokade vagnar på SJ-tåg – resande får lösa avståndet själva

Lady complains about the trains being too full as she unnecessarily travels to Åre (another skiing resort) with her husband and two children for Christmas.

Erik skulle ha firat jul i Bohuslän – blir fast i Danmark

“Boo-hoo me and my Danish family can’t go to our seaside holiday home in Bohuslän over Christmas”

[Similar]

I’ve been wondering if, in 10-20 years, there’ll be this myth about how we all came together and vanquished Covid (assuming there won’t just be pandemic after pandemic from now, of course). I have a feeling we’ll see just how fast history can change.

[BillButNotBen]

The irony of extremely wealthy old white guys whinging about this shit. Want to do something concretely useful for people who can’t gig? Set up a fund that organises and pays musicians for livestream gigs or something.

It’s a shame about Clapton and Van Morison. To be fair, I think the funds from their misjudged songs are at least supposed to go to some kind of fund.

Saw Morison live a few decades ago and he was awful. Was reading the lyrics off cards on the floor and didn’t really seem to give a shit.

[Vandelay]

Highly likely this will be the case and there will be an exaggeration on how much everyone pulled together. I doubt it will take even that long to be spouted, as it will certainly be trumpeted here in the UK by our lot in power as a means to bolster nationalism and to hide their own incompetence. The success of getting through will be on us, but so will all the problems encountered.

To be fair though, I would say the majority of people are doing things correctly. The problem is, you don’t need many people ignoring all the rules to keep the thing circulating. 70% of people doing as they should isn’t enough, you need pretty much 90%+ doing it.

The other problem is that guidelines aren’t good enough and you need actual rules. Friday I went to the cinema to see the new Wonder Woman. We barely were able to get a parking space and our Sainsbury’s was heaving, with almost as many people as you would expect on any other Friday before Christmas. Lots of people milling around chatting, children running about, etc. My brother also went to the post office and need to queue for about 25 minutes. (By contrast, the cinema was being run fantastically and continued to feel like the safest place outside my own home - although it never being more than about 1/5th full helps that.)

That same town on the Monday after we had been moved to tier 4 was supposedly completely dead, I hear from other family members. No doubt some of that is due to many of the shops being closed, but there was still the food shops open that would normally be packed.

I think it is an accurate stereotype that the British are generally rule followers. If you don’t actually put those rules in place and spout nonsense about “British common sense” then a lot of people will do whatever they want.

[Sarfrin]

I think it is an accurate stereotype that the British are generally rule followers. If you don’t actually put those rules in place and spout nonsense about “British common sense” then a lot of people will do whatever they want

I think people associated with those in power being seen to flout the rules hasn’t helped either. Nor has the basic untrustworthiness of our current government.

[Vandelay]

Absolutely. The Barnham Castle incident spelled the end for a number of people taking any of it seriously. The whole “Eat Out to Help Out” kicking off shortly after that and the nicer weather no doubt compounded it all.